Template talk:ItemsList
Repeating Armor Stats I have noticed that allot of the manufacturers have items stats that are repeated on two different names. Agent Armor and the Hydra Armor from Aldrin Labs, for example. Do we need two different tables with the same item name? Or should the title be changed to show the two names ("Light Agent/Hydra Armor (human, turian)", for example). --silverstrike 10:56, September 21, 2009 (UTC) Items image gallery Armor gallery for the ItemsList template. Human File:Ashley_onyx.png|Onyx Armor File:Shepard_onyx.png|Onyx Armor File:Aldrin_Labs_-_Onyx_Armor_(Light,_Human).png|Light Onyx Armor File:Onyx_shepard_l.png|Light Onyx Armor File:Onyx_h_l.png|Light Onyx Armor File:Kaidan_Alenko_-_Eden_Prime2.jpg|Onyx Armor File:Aldrin_Labs_-_Onyx_Armor_(Medium,_Human).png|Medium Onyx Armor File:Onyx_h_m.png|Medium Onyx Armor File:Aldrin_Labs_-_Onyx_Armor_(Hevy,_Human).png|Heavy Onyx Armor File:Aldrin_Labs_-_Hydra_Armor_(Light,_Human).png|Light Hydra Armor File:Aldrin_Labs_-_Hydra_Armor_(Medium,_Human).png|Medium Hydra Armor File:Aldrin_Labs_-_Hydra_Armor_(Hevy,_Human).png|Heavy Hydra Armor File:Mercenary_ligh.png|Light Mercenary Armor File:Ariake_Technologies_-_Mercenary_Armor_(Light,_Human).png|Light Mercenary Armor File:Ariake_Technologies_-_Mercenary_Armor_(Medium,_Human).png|Medium Mercenary Armor File:Ariake_Technologies_-_Mercenary_Armor_(Hevy,_Human).png|Heavy Mercenary Armor File:Hahne-Kedar_-_Predator_Armor_(Light,_Human).png|Light Predator Armor File:Hahne-Kedar_-_Predator_Armor_(Medium,_Human).png|Medium Predator Armor File:Hahne-Kedar_-_Predator_Armor_(Hevy,_Human).png|Heavy Predator Armor File:Armax_Arsenal_-_Predator_L_Armor_(Light,_Human).png|Predator L Armor File:Armax_Arsenal_-_Predator_M_Armor_(Medium,_Human).png|Predator M Armor File:Armax_Arsenal_-_Predator_H_Armor_(Hevy,_Human).png|Predator H Armor File:Devlon_Industries_-_Explorer_Armor_(Light,_Human).png|Light Explorer Armor File:Devlon_Industries_-_Explorer_Armor_(Medium,_Human).png|Medium Explorer Armor File:Devlon_Industries_-_Explorer_Armor_(Hevy,_Human).png|Heavy Explorer Armor File:Devlon_Industries_-_Liberator_Armor_(Light,_Human).png|Light Liberator Armor File:Devlon_Industries_-_Liberator_Armor_(Medium,_Human).png|Medium Liberator Armor File:Devlon_Industries_-_Liberator_Armor_(Hevy,_Human).png|Heavy Liberator Armor File:Devlon_Industries_-_Survivor_Armor_(Light,_Human).png|Light Survivor Armor File:Devlon_Industries_-_Survivor_Armor_(Medium,_Human).png|Medium Survivor Armor File:Devlon_Industries_-_Survivor_Armor_(Hevy,_Human).png|Heavy Survivor Armor File:Elanus_Risk_Control_-_Duelist_Armor_(Light,_Human).png|Light Duelist Armor File:Elanus_Risk_Control_-_Duelist_Armor_(Medium,_Human).png|Medium Duelist Armor File:Elanus_Risk_Control_-_Duelist_Armor_(Hevy,_Human).png|Heavy Duelist Armor File:Elanus_Risk_Control_-_Guardian_Armor_(Light,_Human).png|Light Guardian Armor File:Elanus_Risk_Control_-_Guardian_Armor_(Medium,_Human).png|Medium Guardian Armor File:Elanus_Risk_Control_-_Guardian_Armor_(Hevy,_Human).png|Heavy Guardian Armor File:Hahne-Kedar_-_Mantis_Armor_(Light,_Human).png|Light Mantis Armor File:Hahne-Kedar_-_Mantis_Armor_(Medium,_Human).png|Medium Mantis Armor File:Hahne-Kedar_-_Mantis_Armor_(Hevy,_Human).png|Heavy Mantis Armor File:Hahne-Kedar_-_Scorpion_Armor_(Light,_Human).png|Light Scorpion Armor File:Hahne-Kedar_-_Scorpion_Armor_(Medium,_Human).png|Medium Scorpion Armor File:Hahne-Kedar_-_Scorpion_Armor_(Hevy,_Human).png|Heavy Scorpion Armor File:Hahne-Kedar_-_Ursa_Armor_(Light,_Human).png|Light Ursa Armor File:Hahne-Kedar_-_Ursa_Armor_(Medium,_Human).png|Medium Ursa Armor File:Hahne-Kedar_-_Ursa_Armor_(Hevy,_Human).png|Heavy Ursa Armor File:Spectre_Armour.png|Spectre Armor File:Spectre_Armor.png|Spectre Armor File:Janissary_human.png|Janissary Armor File:Colossus_Armor_-_HumanL_-_Liara_-_Inventory_Screen.jpg|Light Colossus Armor File:Kassa_Fabrication_-_Colossus_Armor_(Light,_Human).png|Light Colossus Armor File:Kassa_Fabrication_-_Colossus_Armor_(Medium,_Human).png|Medium Colossus Armor File:Kassa_Fabrication_-_Colossus_Armor_(Hevy,_Human).png|Heavy Colossus Armor File:Rosenkov_Materials_-_Titan_Armor_(Light,_Human).png|Light Titan Armor File:Rosenkov_Materials_-_Titan_Armor_(Medium,_Human).png|Medium Titan Armor File:Rosenkov_Materials_-_Titan_Armor_(Hevy,_Human).png|Heavy Titan Armor File:Sirta_Foundation_-_Phoenix_Armor_(Light,_Human).png|Light Phoenix Armor File:Phoenix_h_l.png|Light Phoenix Armor File:Sirta_Foundation_-_Phoenix_Armor_(Medium,_Human).png|Medium Phoenix Armor File:Phoenix_h_m.png|Medium Phoenix Armor File:Sirta_Foundation_-_Phoenix_Armor_(Hevy,_Human).png|Heavy Phoenix Armor File:Phoenix_h_h.png|Heavy Phoenix Armor File:Elkoss_Combine_-_Assassin_Armor_(Light,_Human).png|Light Assassin Armor File:Elkoss_Combine_-_Assassin_Armor_(Medium,_Human).png|Medium Assassin Armor File:Elkoss_Combine_-_Assassin_Armor_(Hevy,_Human).png|Heavy Assassin Armor File:Elkoss_Combine_-_Gladiator_Armor_(Light,_Human).png|Light Gladiator Armor File:Elkoss_Combine_-_Gladiator_Armor_(Medium,_Human).png|Medium Gladiator Armor File:Elkoss_Combine_-_Gladiator_Armor_(Hevy,_Human).png|Heavy Gladiator Armor Quarian File:Hydra_001.jpg|Default Hydra Armor File:Explorer_001.jpg|Explorer Armor File:Liberator_001.jpg|Liberator Armor File:Survivor_001.jpg|Survivor Armor File:Colossus_001.jpg|Colossus Armor File:Phoenix_001.jpg|Phoenix Armor Turian File:Onyx_turian_l.png|Light Onyx Armor File:Onyx_turian_m.png|Medium Onyx Armor File:AgentArmor.jpg|Agent Armor File:Predator_m.png|Predator M Armor File:Janissary_turian.png|Janissary Armor File:Colossus_Armor_-_TurianL_-_Inventory_Screen.jpg|Light Colossus Armor File:Colossus_Armor_-_TurianM_-_Inventory_Screen.jpg|Medium Colossus Armor File:Phoenix_l.png|Light Phoenix Armor File:Phoenix_t_m.png|Medium Phoenix Armor Krogan File:Onyx_m_k.png|Medium Onyx Armor File:Onyx_k_m.png|Medium Onyx Armor File:Onyx_h.png|Heavy Onyx Armor File:Wrex_Mercenary_Armour_Render.jpg|Mercenary Armor File:Mercenary_h.png|Heavy Mercenary Armor File:Explorer_h.png|Heavy Explorer Armor File:Liberator_h.png|Heavy Liberator Armor File:Guardian_h.png|Heavy Guardian Armor File:Mantis_h.png|Heavy Mantis Armor File:Janissary_krogan.png|Janissary Armor File:Colossus_Armor_-_KroganH_-_Inventory_Screen.jpg|Heavy Colossus Armor File:Colossus_h.png|Heavy Colossus Armor File:Phoenix_m.png|Medium Phoenix Armor File:Phoenix_h.png|Heavy Phoenix Armor File:Battlemaster_h.png|Heavy Battelemaster Armor File:Berserker_h.png|Heavy Berserker Armor File:Rage_Armor.png|Heavy Rage Armor Standardizing Items listing You might remember a discussion we had some time ago about standardizing the items listing (Weapon, Armor, Bio-amp, and Omni-tool), to create one list that every article that shows items specifics, pull the data from that list (the discussion is buried somewhere in this talk page - I believe it was January or February of this year). The idea is to create one giant list of items, that can be summoned and filtered based on the relevant criteria. For example: *The Sniper Rifle article could call this list and show only the sniper rifles. *The Hahne-Kedar article could show only items that Hahne-Kadar manufacture. *etc. The reason I bring this up again is due to some inconsistencies I glanced in the last couple of days when looking through the various items listing articles - and as I noted in a topic above, there are some duplications in listing that may cause a stat missing in one page, but appear in another. When a contributor fix or add data to one page, the other pages with same listings could still show bogus information, or lack of any. I don't quite remember how we finished that discussion (I think there are still unfinished templates regarding this issue), but I'd like to finish it, if you (and the other admins) support this change. --silverstrike 16:27, September 17, 2009 (UTC) :So, basically, like having a database that feeds into other item pages depending on the article? That makes sense, I guess. How easy would it be for people to edit that database? --Tullis 16:32, September 17, 2009 (UTC) ::It really depends on the method I use: ::*Using simple wiki templates: users will be redirected to the wiki template to edit the list (or part of it). ::*Using wiki widgets/extensions: I need to read more about MediaWiki, but could be that users could edit a specific table, that will update the main table. ::*Using JavaScript: Users could change the data on tables, in the same ease they change categories (click on the stats they want to change, and just alter the data) - also I could add various behaviors like: sorting, more user filters, etc. ::The method used, is more to your preference, and how comfortable you feel with it - JavaScript can give me allot of free will, and its more a matter of trust (not that I plan on abusing this trust). --silverstrike 07:06, September 18, 2009 (UTC) :::I'm inclined to go with simple templates, but you'd be creating a large number of them, I'd imagine. --Tullis 13:18, September 18, 2009 (UTC) ::::Simple template it is. I don't know how many pages I'll need, but I'll try to bring them to a minimum (3-5 I believe). --silverstrike 13:28, September 18, 2009 (UTC) ::::First stage is done (Template:ItemsList). Before I start the second stage, I'd like to know what sort of filters do we need. There are the obvious: manufacturer, item type, and weight/race for armors - but should I prepare for advanced filters? Like showing only full/partially filled tables, according to stats, only if there is an image or image missing, etc. --silverstrike :::::Simple first, complicated later. Let's get this up and running for those three filters before we add bells and whistles. : ) --Tullis 15:30, September 18, 2009 (UTC) ::::::Okay. I'm on it. --silverstrike 15:33, September 18, 2009 (UTC) Data Finally managed to make the thing work. Still allot of kinks to work out, but basic filtering is working - I changed the name of the manufacturer in the list page (only has three at the moment) to test its functionality. :Before I finish testing the list properly, I want to enter all the inventory data. But I am in a dilemma on which method to use - either I enter the data by manufacturer (go thorough the various manufacturers and list the data in that order) or by item type. What are your thoughts on the matter? --silverstrike 04:38, September 20, 2009 (UTC) ::What will the difference be between the two? --Tullis 14:58, September 20, 2009 (UTC) :::How comfortable it will be for editors to edit the tables. When this page will be finished, it will contain every inventory item in the game (including the PC only) - what will make it extremely long and we need to use a method that will be easy for authors to use. :::...I actually started to write the two methods of laying out the tables, when I realized that they change absolutely nothing, it only change something for the compulsive editor who have no idea what item he wants to edit (something like me - I hit the "Random page" link far too frequently). :::So, after settling that point, what do you think about the rest of the work, and the easiness of editing? Any comments? --silverstrike 15:27, September 20, 2009 (UTC) ::::That's not something I can judge until we actually see it implemented and how it works. As for which method to use: most people won't have the manufacturer's name in their head when they're editing, so item type will be the best way to go. But hopefully this will go toward fixing our equipment listings issues, where we currently have the equipment tables copied on both species armour, the manufacturer, and the armour page itself. My inclination is to take the armour / weapon / bio-amp / omni-tool stats out of manufacturers' pages, and just have a list of their products. --Tullis 15:45, September 20, 2009 (UTC) :::::Sound logical, I'll gather all the items and start filling the list - hopefully it won't take too long. --silverstrike 16:04, September 20, 2009 (UTC) Filters and Testing I have expanded the list with items (still more work to do), and the filters seem to be working. The only problem now (encountered during testing) is the inability to filter based on weapon type - will work on this next. Besides the minor flaws, would appreciate any comment you might have, before continuing the list expansion... --silverstrike 18:15, September 21, 2009 (UTC) :Um. Templates are far from my forte. If you need technical input, you're much better off asking DRY. --Tullis 19:59, September 21, 2009 (UTC) ::What I need is not technical input. I need authors input. Do the ItemsList tag simple enough? Does it gives the results you expect it to? You see something missing? Something wrong? Do you think its ready for production (after filling in the missing items)? --silverstrike 20:05, September 21, 2009 (UTC) :::Okay, give me time to go through it. Believe it or not I have a lot on my plate. : ) --Tullis 20:11, September 21, 2009 (UTC) ::::Now I feel guilty :/. Didn't mean to rush you - take your time, I finished the major part of the work, when I'll get the "all clear" I'll finish filling in the data. --silverstrike 22:04, September 21, 2009 (UTC) :::::I took a look at the tables. I'm a little tired but they honestly look fine to me: nothing immediately jumped out as missing or problematic. It occurred to me that once they're implemented, 90% of users aren't going to do anything with those tables except use them. : ) It's like the planet templates: how often do they get edited? But anything that cleans up the armour and equipment pages is great in my book. My main goal for these is that we don't have the same information endlessly repeated on a dozen pages, and effectively drawing it from a database should fix that because it'll just be deploying a template. :::::One question: is there a filter for armour type? Say, to display all Predator or Scorpion or Colossus Armours? If we're going to keep the main armour set pages (and I think we should) that's one filter we'll need. --Tullis 01:29, September 22, 2009 (UTC) ::::::No filter for armor type at the time, I commented on problem one the template talk page, but yet to receive any response. I have two ways ways to tackle this problem: either filtering by item name/label, or adding a specific field/parameter for item name - the end result will be the same (if the item label appear on the title), but execution is no problem either way. ::::::Regarding the edits of the page - I agree with your assessment. Very few people will edit this page, but I still try to make the edit as simple as possible - for those who choose to edit it. Hopefully, we could duplicate a similar template for ME2 when it comes out, and prevent that mess in the future. I'll continue to update the information, and will notify you upon completion, so we can start making the change - I managed to build it in such a way, that it is extremely easy to add filters, so I'm open to suggestions. ::::::I am also thinking of a way to link to the list of tables, and three ideas: ::::::#Manually insert a link at some location on the page. ::::::#Put a link at the top/bottom of each table. ::::::#Put a link at the beginning/end of the template output. ::::::I think that you can remove most of this discussion (or just move it to the template talk page) - most of it is settled. --silverstrike 02:26, September 22, 2009 (UTC) Final Testing The filling of the tables from the various manufacturers pages is finished. What left is going through the weapons and armors existing listings (Assault Rifle, Pistol, etc.) and update where necessary - also, allot of brands specific articles (Spectre - Master Gear, Gladiator Armor, etc.) to locate missing tables/stats. Other then that, the template seems to be ready for publish (I have updated the Aldrin Labs, Armali Council, and Ariake Technologies pages for working example). --silverstrike 01:37, September 23, 2009 (UTC) Armor Pages I would like to know why you overhauled all the armor pages? Not trying to sound rude, just wondering (I put a lot of work into formatting them, and adding pictures). Lehvi Dession 01:26, September 25, 2009 (UTC) :I was just answering your question over here. : ) --Tullis 01:28, September 25, 2009 (UTC) Image issue It's been brought to my attention that we have an image problem with the armour pages. Getting the template to display all quarian armour shows the stats just fine, but instead of quarian images, we have humans wearing the same armour. Ditto for the turian armour page. Actually, having the images embedded in the templates is also causing a few alignment / layout issues here and there. Is there a way to fix this? --Tullis 23:21, October 1, 2009 (UTC) :I am aware about this problem and in your talk page I brought some ideas to resolve the images issue. Beyond those ideas, I think that the best solution is to generate images names automatically based on the table stats and filters when calling the template - the problem in this approach is that it will force us to change the names of existing images. :I have mentioned some minor issues that needs to be addressed in talk pages, but with no response. I don't like making those decisions by myself - especially when I am aware that some authors don't like them (as noted above and in your talk page) - which is the reason I didn't proceed with this project for the last couple of days, I'm just waiting for any kind of response. --silverstrike 09:22, October 2, 2009 (UTC) ::I apologise. Work has been keeping me somewhat distracted. I don't have a problem with changing image names so that they work with the templates. Image names get changed all the time if necessary, this is certainly a situation that warrants it, and if we keep a redirect in place, that should cover any issues. Besides, the armour images will really only be used for that specific set of armour, so if we have to fix them anywhere else, those instances will be rare. --Tullis 12:20, October 2, 2009 (UTC) :::No apologies necessary. Contributing to the wiki don't pay enough to give a 24/7 commitment :p - I can be patient and wait for the response : ). :::I will upload a couple of test images to make sure everything is working as should be before changing the names of the images (I still need to know what images to rename. There are some duplicates). --silverstrike 13:10, October 2, 2009 (UTC) ::::Shout out the duplicates on my Talk page and I'll take a look. ::::Yeah: work is very draining, and my time's kind of on a premium too as a result, but I wouldn't swap my job for anything. Unfortunately that does mean I have less creativity left for my own work, but I find working on the wiki a kind of meditation, if that makes sense. It doesn't take as much creative energy but it gives a nice feeling to set everything in order. --Tullis 13:19, October 2, 2009 (UTC) :::::All the armor images including duplicates are located on the template talk page - they are grouped by race (every race has its own gallery) and ordered by armor name/label. :::::I have made the changes to the template, and for the moment instead of images, the template shows a text line in the form of: <> - you can check out the items pages or the items listing template to make sure everything is working okay. :::::The only disadvantage in this approach is that we must use a standard image format (jpg or png) - what means we'll need to change the format where necessary, and try to keep images with the same aspect ratio (to reduce occurrences of images being too high and taking up space between tables). Other then those two, I don't see any additional problems. :::::I am waiting for your input before progressing any further... --silverstrike 15:18, October 2, 2009 (UTC) ::::::I'll check this when I get home tonight. Thanks for getting on it so fast. --Tullis 15:29, October 2, 2009 (UTC) :::::::Well, a minor complication with the moving of images - it seems that I don't have the right permission for that operation, so either I'll leave it up to you, or assign me a temporary permission to do so. --silverstrike 15:52, October 3, 2009 (UTC) ::::Please give me a list of the images and what needs to be done to them; I'll also put them into a fixed aspect ratio if necessary. --Tullis 18:24, October 3, 2009 (UTC) :::::They are on the template talk page. Most of them can be renamed, except from a few that have duplicates - the decision of what to do with them is yours. --silverstrike 19:16, October 3, 2009 (UTC) :::::Forgot to mention: The renaming should be in the form of "weight-race-item_name", for example: Heavy-krogan-Warlord, Medium-human-Predator M, etc. I think that the extension should be "png" - it will give better quality - but the decision is up to you. --silverstrike 19:21, October 3, 2009 (UTC) ::::::This... may take a while. I'll do the quarian armours first as a test run. --Tullis 20:22, October 3, 2009 (UTC) :::::::Had to fix a bug in the code, but the template seems to be working. You can check out the Quarian Armor page for a working example. The only issue now, is fine-tuning the image tag to show the image at the right proportions. --silverstrike 20:55, October 3, 2009 (UTC) :::Yeah, right now we're getting huge gaps between tables, but at least we're getting the right images. While I remember: do ALL armour images need to be the same aspect ratio, or just those for specific races? --Tullis 21:01, October 3, 2009 (UTC) ::::All of them. The other solution is to disregard the ratio, and give the option to specify the width for each armor individually by editing the ItemsList template. --silverstrike 21:10, October 3, 2009 (UTC) :::::Sod. That's going to take longer than I thought, and it won't work for the quarian / turian / krogan armours. Though... that shouldn't matter. They'll be superseded by human armour images elsewhere, and those can all be fixed fairly quickly. --Tullis 23:17, October 3, 2009 (UTC) ::::::If fixing the images is too much of a fuss, we could always go back to my previous idea too set the image width for each item separately. It's really not much work --silverstrike 00:00, October 4, 2009 (UTC) ::Yeah, but if we still have all the images different shapes and sizes, they're going to look very weird on a page like, say, turian armour. --Tullis 00:59, October 4, 2009 (UTC) :::Indeed. The ultimate solution is to re-upload all the images with the fixed aspect ration to achieve standardization... --silverstrike 01:18, October 4, 2009 (UTC) ::::I don't have a problem with that--I guess we can fix the quarian armour pictures last. --Tullis 16:48, October 4, 2009 (UTC) Update I'm going to begin fixing the armour images and aspect ratios, going through one armour type at a time. To summarise the discussion above: * We need a fixed aspect ratio for all armour images * We need to change the armour names to, say, Medium-human-Predator M * We need to save the images as .png to make it work right * Then we need to fine-tune the image tag so they display properly. Have I missed anything? --Tullis 23:05, November 1, 2009 (UTC) :The image tag is automatically generated by this template and does not require maintenance. I can add another option for specifying the width of the image, and giving default value if the width is not specified - this can help in fine-tuning the image if necessary. :Regarding the file naming, I can make a tiny change to the template to force the names to be lower-case letters (this can help avoid mistakes). --silverstrike 17:55, November 2, 2009 (UTC) Updates Finished migrating all the items pages to the new template (as far as I know), and now continue to update the template with images - which will be selected arbitrarily by me (and available for change by authors) with the options of specifying a different image on template call. Another addition is the auto categorization that will be added to the template for the unification of all the pages that use the template. --silverstrike 21:00, September 27, 2009 (UTC) help parameter The help parameter should probably be removed. It is redundant with the documentation and clutters the implementation. --DRY 15:58, June 5, 2010 (UTC) Missing data? I've noticed that some of the data from the tables are missing, such as Elanus Risk Control Services Human Medium Duelist/Guardian I and V. However, those armours do exist in the game. You can easily verify that by using giveallarmorhuman manf_elanus_armor_duelist. Same thing with Batarian State Arms Light Human Partisan I-IX and others. So shouldn't those gaps be filled? And on the other side are things like Kassa Fabrication Medium Human Colossus I-VI, which are in the table but do not exist in the game (giveallarmorhuman manf_kassa_armor_colossus gives you only ones from VII). Shouldn't those be deleted? --GreatEmerald 17:40, June 25, 2011 (UTC) :I've filled the missing data and removed the ones that I couldn't get from using the giveall codes. However, one thing worries me: if you do giveallweapons manf_armax_weap, you only get weapons from VII and up. However, you can use giveitem self 1 pistol manf_armax_weap and you will in fact get the tier I Brawler. So I do believe that they need to be filled completely, since after all they exist in the game, even if they are not normally obtainable. However, perhaps it should be marked which items do appear in the game and which do not. However, gathering that data may be difficult. Another problem is with Kassa Fabrication Omni-tool. It is not obtainable using codes at all, or at least I can't find the code that would give me those omni-tools. But they exist, at least if you trust the manufacturer's description. So that's something else to be aware of. --GreatEmerald 19:00, June 28, 2011 (UTC)